Path: csiph.com!v102.xanadu-bbs.net!xanadu-bbs.net!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed3a.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.003 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'scripts': 0.03; 'source,': 0.04; 'reason,': 0.07; 'alternatives': 0.09; 'properly.': 0.09; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.11; 'random': 0.14; '4:39': 0.16; 'block.': 0.16; 'cases)': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'jumped': 0.16; 'mangled': 0.16; 'sorts': 0.16; 'throw': 0.16; 'underlying': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'wed,': 0.18; 'trying': 0.19; 'thu,': 0.19; 'user.': 0.19; '(in': 0.22; 'aug': 0.22; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.22; 'instance,': 0.24; 'looks': 0.24; 'cc:2**0': 0.24; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'chris': 0.29; 'am,': 0.29; 'css': 0.30; 'field,': 0.30; 'message- id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; 'easier': 0.31; '13,': 0.31; 'disabled': 0.31; 'occurs': 0.31; 'everyone': 0.33; "can't": 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; '14,': 0.36; 'passwords': 0.36; 'wrong': 0.37; 'so,': 0.37; 'two': 0.37; 'thank': 0.38; 'fact': 0.38; 'read': 0.60; 'future': 0.60; 'most': 0.60; 'gone': 0.61; 'simple': 0.61; 'back': 0.62; 'field': 0.63; 'skip:n 10': 0.64; 'more': 0.64; 'laid': 0.84; 'messed': 0.84; 'to:none': 0.92 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:cc :content-type; bh=mk/I9Gw2hSuS01OifbWmye1XTBd7TdGQ0DX/Dso1wUA=; b=rFKjk9MOXZd+f3iKvAiFTbXlDeH7ZpGy0LRR0aJ85h7ev/Jn/1pcksYLaciRbxadUv sXDV2BE70HY2YsCKA/pz8euMBuWWqA814Xk98iW0D77MPHil3jfgLF8h9rL+HZYxR6A9 zRGPhHURi1nmRIibOL3WlNOGoNKed7trtrbnlG3oQFcoD4wD5WwPqokO4fUob4x/P6Kp Hek+Nw9LVheMCFNaDStkk1aaMTHTTo2qpJ2+pxbP5QbX4VOikubawrHCOr2pp1ROTc72 dprxan1DRFvSZrItdl1ykyeMGzZLAW9KAfaBz+sxEJsobTtjUErRb/dzsQLj9DJhB0wE DfDQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.43.96.65 with SMTP id cf1mr9135459icc.26.1407959033095; Wed, 13 Aug 2014 12:43:53 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <8c2e4bc2-4f46-4a68-83ed-469fe171de3a@googlegroups.com> <2320baf0-e097-4d67-97c1-dd37ca79fffb@googlegroups.com> <376a239c-77e8-4e0e-9300-847dfa8a8547@googlegroups.com> <53EB4E68.8050405@harvee.org> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2014 05:43:53 +1000 Subject: Re: Captcha identify From: Chris Angelico Cc: "python-list@python.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 29 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1407959035 news.xs4all.nl 2864 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:35466 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:76231 On Thu, Aug 14, 2014 at 5:24 AM, Chris Kaynor wrote: > On Wed, Aug 13, 2014 at 4:39 AM, Eric S. Johansson wrote: >> >> eliminate captchas, 35+million disabled people would thank you as would >> many more millions of the not-yet-disabled like your future self. > > > And so would the spammers, which is who captchas are trying to block. There are alternatives that are both easier for legit people and harder for spambots. Some rely on the fact that humans read things two dimensionally, and scripts look at the underlying structure; so, for instance, random field names and cunning CSS to match them up with their labels can result in a form that's completely messed up in the source, but looks perfect to a user. Or you can put extra fields down that you can't see if the form's laid out properly. Or you can combine those sorts of tricks with a very simple challenge-response, like "What is one plus one?" that requires some specific value to be in a specific field - and if that value occurs in the wrong field, you throw the form back to the user. For some reason, everyone's jumped on the "show some mangled text/numbers and ask the user to enter them" bandwagon, in the same way that everyone has gone for passwords that require lower/upper/digit/symbol and (in the most annoying cases) are actually length-limited to something stupid like 12 characters. Yes, maximum, not minimum. Grumble. ChrisA