Path: csiph.com!news.mixmin.net!news.unit0.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail From: Random832 Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Subject: Re: Coding systems are political (was Exended ASCII and code pages) Date: Sat, 28 May 2016 14:05:40 -0400 Lines: 22 Message-ID: References: <5743a8d2$0$1587$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <7D6476C4-9969-4648-AB43-4CE0C7115B9C@icloud.com> <57457c4f$0$11122$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> <57461326.5040606@lucidity.plus.com> <5746AFA3.9020303@lucidity.plus.com> <8737p589bo.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <57475CB5.7010102@lucidity.plus.com> <87pos8y14e.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <5747c071$0$1593$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87fut4xc8w.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <5747ed83$0$1620$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <8760u0x9qu.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <574819d8$0$1598$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1464357085.645851.620574537.560EAC9E@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1464365340.674161.620708793.4CE81D69@webmail.messagingengine.com> <37c8a09e-f18b-44ab-8650-0146924bbb9e@googlegroups.com> <1464458740.544484.621455137.2D6EA255@webmail.messagingengine.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de ZZRO4NJeF6nZlYf/GsXJ4Ah8wkUxhMeSKbZh3y/mvXYA== Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.003 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; 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'means': 0.39; "didn't": 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.40; 'header:Message-Id:1': 0.61; 'more': 0.63; 'information': 0.63; 'therefore': 0.67; 'prime': 0.72; 'chinese': 0.79; 'ucs-2': 0.84; 'density': 0.91; 'asian': 0.93; 'imagine': 0.96 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fastmail.com; h= content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-sasl-enc :x-sasl-enc; s=mesmtp; bh=FEorKAlPodzLMbPJ0rQpa6WPlF8=; b=aX3Vjo qGS4W/Rmvq/wOD3sCLjBz9ai/zmOM3YTNiTK8+1MgRY5oLT3Zhw1JPX7fb5KMQdN tJrEuiHdCqJDixrVtIAcvvO91+noacr9KCnilLqq91vU4B/DbnNfYecrWvlW/MRT dr5bH50fsEUTHln8ti0uWeW5Yc5PWsT0jrsUE= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-sasl-enc:x-sasl-enc; s=smtpout; bh=FEorKAlPodzLMbP J0rQpa6WPlF8=; b=cQ+YVIBFfyt4LIs2PcDav7PmlpZ0j9rakyVfY5+jKoHZfNZ 643wX670dmR8t9z31J+Ju8huUhFr6QugqPBsB2cRgM9VWRhujSOrqVwun766T37j iE00CANiCRm6Xb+qiQKz3uYJHaER9/FeLmsRR5wcTSIMR4b9WI3sjROBhfEY= X-Sasl-Enc: 84zhnxm3dDsfMfRn4RRih06VhQ8Lvt/4DDiaeTYwjt4/ 1464458740 X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-b882aaad In-Reply-To: <37c8a09e-f18b-44ab-8650-0146924bbb9e@googlegroups.com> X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Mailman-Original-Message-ID: <1464458740.544484.621455137.2D6EA255@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Mailman-Original-References: <5743a8d2$0$1587$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <7D6476C4-9969-4648-AB43-4CE0C7115B9C@icloud.com> <57457c4f$0$11122$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> <57461326.5040606@lucidity.plus.com> <5746AFA3.9020303@lucidity.plus.com> <8737p589bo.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <57475CB5.7010102@lucidity.plus.com> <87pos8y14e.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <5747c071$0$1593$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87fut4xc8w.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <5747ed83$0$1620$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <8760u0x9qu.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <574819d8$0$1598$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1464357085.645851.620574537.560EAC9E@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1464365340.674161.620708793.4CE81D69@webmail.messagingengine.com> <37c8a09e-f18b-44ab-8650-0146924bbb9e@googlegroups.com> Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:109218 On Sat, May 28, 2016, at 00:46, Rustom Mody wrote: > Which also means that if the Chinese were to have more say in the > design of Unicode/ UTF-8 they would likely not waste swathes of prime > real-estate for almost never used control characters just in the name > of ASCII compliance There are only 128 code points in the single-byte range of UTF-8. Only 32 of which are used for, almost-never-used or otherwise, control characters. What do you imagine they would have put there instead? At least Unicode doesn't do as badly as the first-draft ISO-UCS, which didn't allow a C0/C1 control value in *any* position in UCS-2 or UCS-4, therefore UCS-2 would encode only 192*192=36,864 codepoints as two bytes (and 64 control characters as one byte), as opposed to UTF-16's 63,488 (including all control characters) two-byte characters. For completeness, I'll note that conventional East Asian character coding systems do have a higher information density compared to UTF-8, but at a cost of not being self-synchronizing. And their single-byte characters are in fact ASCII and C0/C1 controls, with only Japanese Shift- JIS encodings additionally having Katakana as single-byte characters.