Path: csiph.com!x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net!usenet.pasdenom.info!aioe.org!feeder.news-service.com!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed5.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.002 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'subject:Python': 0.04; 'wed,': 0.04; 'arguments': 0.05; 'pointer': 0.05; 'c++,': 0.07; 'see:': 0.07; 'called.': 0.09; 'initialized': 0.09; 'pm,': 0.11; '>>>': 0.12; 'wrote:': 0.14; 'category,': 0.16; 'definition,': 0.16; "isn't.": 0.16; 'mistaken.': 0.16; 'url:ibm': 0.16; "\xa0it's": 0.16; 'url:doc': 0.20; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.22; 'value.': 0.25; 'parameters': 0.26; 'received:209.85.161.46': 0.26; 'received:mail-fx0-f46.google.com': 0.26; 'subject:data': 0.26; 'pass': 0.27; 'function': 0.27; 'message- id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.28; 'supports': 0.29; 'received:209.85.161': 0.29; 'subject:?': 0.29; 'fact': 0.31; 'however,': 0.31; 'actual': 0.31; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.32; 'another': 0.32; 'source': 0.32; 'agree': 0.32; 'reference': 0.34; 'actually': 0.34; 'certain': 0.34; 'there': 0.35; 'subject:What': 0.35; 'subject:use': 0.35; 'received:209.85': 0.37; 'either': 0.37; 'received:google.com': 0.38; 'reasonable': 0.38; 'under': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'received:209': 0.39; 'header:Received:5': 0.40; '2011': 0.62; 'url:%2f': 0.63; 'perfectly': 0.65; 'url:jsp': 0.65; 'url:htm': 0.72; 'claim': 0.76; 'subject:other': 0.84; 'url:topic': 0.84; 'edwards': 0.91 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=vaBUOW1JLJ56UHIOwdrud6omBq8C7ME3E+ZF+gvkWR0=; b=NA/AH2SkJyyW5NU5+xIcnmrAQ4stkNdrjzMp71NBVp3oXFS7reA9fo81xJN2QhMnwR rm3ivQXOZr1ED4/fLDY4lEnrw1/ezkL4LDjDBt6t9FO6mXYze2Jm6ZBXlDyOcOMjd1xr eK8NoIr9qdXt+1cP7PimGIcF7F+LkL7THKRDw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=CfKu+OjqJheFDp8B7Bijsc43Oc4YmOuFZCo7f7CDYyroD/pQ8Zs7A2nePv8J3g2Ezm PPYwQZ3WMkmrvuHTBvlVWQge530XMrJrm2LJe1QDKW3Hoi83zWnezRbcWeg5jMtaoR47 AU8DuF+zUYBFZyYjxQGZDCsiKq63ATlUiLGYk= MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: References: <4dbd1dbf$0$29991$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <77f64071-b288-404c-8280-b2c61ba77f06@n10g2000yqf.googlegroups.com> From: Ian Kelly Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 16:22:42 -0600 Subject: Re: What other languages use the same data model as Python? To: Python Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 28 NNTP-Posting-Host: 82.94.164.166 X-Trace: 1304548013 news.xs4all.nl 81485 [::ffff:82.94.164.166]:42023 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.python:4671 On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 3:35 PM, harrismh777 wrote= : > Grant Edwards wrote: >>> >>> We do not consider passing a pointer as*by value* =A0because its an >>> > =A0address; by definition, that is pass-by-reference. >> >> No, it isn't. =A0It's pass by value. =A0The fact that you are passing a >> value that is a pointer to another value is not relevent. >> > > @ Edwards, &Schaathun > > You are most definitely mistaken. =A0 See: > > http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/comphelp/v8v101/index.jsp?topic= =3D%2Fcom.ibm.xlcpp8a.doc%2Flanguage%2Fref%2Fcplr233.htm That source actually supports the claim that pass-by-pointer falls under pass-by-value. It reads, in part (emphasis added): > In C++, the reference parameters are initialized with the actual argument= s when the function is called. In C, the pointer parameters > are initializ= ed with pointer _values_ when the function is called. However, I hope we can all agree that pass-by-pointer shares certain features with both pass-by-value and pass-by-reference, and there are perfectly reasonable arguments for lumping it in either category, yes?