Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!gegeweb.org!de-l.enfer-du-nord.net!feeder1.enfer-du-nord.net!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed6.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.018 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.96; '*S*': 0.00; 'talks': 0.03; 'mathematics': 0.04; 'completeness': 0.07; 'subject:Python': 0.07; 'context': 0.09; "person's": 0.09; 'rigorous': 0.09; 'to:name :python-list@python.org': 0.15; '10+': 0.16; 'context.': 0.16; 'currencies': 0.16; 'disclaimers': 0.16; 'disclaimers,': 0.16; 'exist,': 0.16; 'from:addr:jpmorgan.com': 0.16; 'geometry,': 0.16; 'graph': 0.16; 'indirectly': 0.16; 'justify': 0.16; 'math,': 0.16; 'observations': 0.16; 'quantum': 0.16; 'received:155.180': 0.16; 'received:155.180.234': 0.16; 'received:159': 0.16; 'received:159.53': 0.16; 'received:bankone.net': 0.16; 'received:exchad.jpmchase.net': 0.16; 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'information,': 0.65; 'model': 0.65; 'ever': 0.65; 'real-world': 0.66; 'times': 0.66; 'category': 0.67; 'presented': 0.67; 'purchase': 0.67; 'making': 0.67; 'refer': 0.69; 'subject': 0.70; 'investment': 0.71; 'legal': 0.73; 'bank': 0.74; 'sale': 0.75; '100%': 0.82; '712': 0.84; 'century,': 0.84; 'houston,': 0.84; 'mechanics': 0.84; 'poorly': 0.84; 'received:169.254.8': 0.84; 'tastes': 0.84; 'textures': 0.84; 'theory': 0.84; 'joel': 0.91; '20th': 0.95; 'old.': 0.95; 'hundred': 0.96; 'incredibly': 0.96; 'papers': 0.96 X-DKIM: OpenDKIM Filter v2.1.3 sf1.jpmchase.com q2UGeRHg006706 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=jpmorgan.com; s=smtpout; t=1333125627; bh=Z5T/SP0W6w9nGXoWUd/GU3AsmWpwY34x7Nx9b/URKIs=; h=From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:References:In-Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=uEmnSOTnpAlX6xHpafbCY8P9bRdRjczgDkgsy5D9eZla8PQfoWwQUvDaY1aLGQmX+ 6KvVC5CcEKFuT9BQRnUncwjnK1tFbM4zToEyL9nD1Wy2PcMmXcC/Uakvlg6LqnGYUd jRRvnr0GdYKE8ivMJHX+NzUPhPPu/pf1sjVOPJeI= From: "Prasad, Ramit" To: "python-list@python.org" Subject: RE: Python is readable Thread-Topic: Python is readable Thread-Index: AQHNDiZJWC+9yu1gQ0ehWZAtXavFrJaChKYAgABzVXA= Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 16:40:19 +0000 References: <4f612b19$0$1379$4fafbaef@reader2.news.tin.it> <4f750f9f$0$29981$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <4f752a3a$0$29981$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.67.79.38] Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DLP-FWD: Yes Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 43 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1333125631 news.xs4all.nl 6939 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:56239 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:22385 > > My aunt makes the best damn lasagna you've ever tasted without any=0D= =0A> > overarching abstract theory of human taste=2E And if you think that= =0D=0A> quantum=0D=0A> > mechanics is more difficult than understanding hum= an perceptions of=0D=0A> > taste, you are badly mistaken=2E=0D=0A> =0D=0A> = Taste is subjective, and your aunt probably started from a good recipe=0D= =0A> and tweaked it for local palates=2E That recipe could easily be over = a=0D=0A> hundred years old=2E An overarching mathematical theory of human= =0D=0A> taste/mouth perception, if such a silly thing were to exist, would = be=0D=0A> able to generate new recipes that were perfect for a given person= 's=0D=0A> tastes very quickly=2E=0D=0A> =0D=0A> Additionally, just to troll= this point some more (fun times!), I would=0D=0A> argue that there is an i= mplicit theory of human taste (chefs refer to=0D=0A> it indirectly as gastr= onomy) that is very poorly organized and lacks=0D=0A> any sort of scientifi= c rigor=2E Nonetheless, enough empirical=0D=0A> observations about pairing= s of flavors, aromas and textures have been=0D=0A> made to guide the creati= on of new recipes=2E Gastronomy doesn't need to=0D=0A> be organized or rig= orous because fundamentally it isn't very=0D=0A> important=2E=0D=0A=0D=0AI = cannot live without eating, I can live just fine without math=2E =0D=0AYour= opinion that gastronomy is fundamentally unimportant is =0D=0Afundamentall= y flawed=2E =0D=0A=0D=0A> > In any case, Spolsky is not making a general at= tack on abstract science=2E=0D=0A> > Your hyperbole is completely unjustifi= ed=2E=0D=0A> =0D=0A> The mathematics of the 20th century, (from the early 3= 0s onward) tend=0D=0A> to get VERY abstract, in just the way Joel decries= =2E Category theory,=0D=0A> model theory, modern algebraic geometry, topos= theory, algebraic graph=0D=0A> theory, abstract algebras and topological c= omplexes are all very=0D=0A> difficult to understand because they seem so i= ncredibly abstract, yet=0D=0A> most of them already have important applicat= ions=2E I'm 100% positive=0D=0A> if you just presented Joel with seminal p= apers in some of those areas,=0D=0A> he would apply the "astronaut" rubber = stamp, because the material is=0D=0A> challenging, and he wouldn't get it (= I love math, and I've had to read=0D=0A> some papers 10+ times before they = click)=2E=0D=0A=0D=0AI do not think that you can compare abstract vs real w= orld=2E =0D=0AJoel talks in the context of solving real-world problems for = a living=0D=0Aand producing tangible results to justify employment=2E It is= only fair =0D=0Ato talk about mathematics in the same context=2E Or vice-v= ersa=2E=0D=0A=0D=0AJoining-the-trolling-bandwagon,=0D=0ARamit=0D=0A=0D=0A= =0D=0ARamit Prasad | JPMorgan Chase Investment Bank | Currencies Technology= =0D=0A712 Main Street | Houston, TX 77002=0D=0Awork phone: 713 - 216 - 5423= =0D=0A=0D=0A--=0D=0A=0D=0AThis email is confidential and subject to importa= nt disclaimers and=0D=0Aconditions including on offers for the purchase or = sale of=0D=0Asecurities, accuracy and completeness of information, viruses,= =0D=0Aconfidentiality, legal privilege, and legal entity disclaimers,=0D=0A= available at http://www=2Ejpmorgan=2Ecom/pages/disclosures/email=2E