Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder4.news.weretis.net!rt.uk.eu.org!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed1.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.123 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.75; '*S*': 0.00; 'subject:: [': 0.04; 'sucks': 0.09; 'cheer': 0.16; 'effect.': 0.16; 'eliminating': 0.16; 'from:addr:torriem': 0.16; 'from:name:michael torrie': 0.16; 'know;': 0.16; 'modem': 0.16; 'segment': 0.16; 'ssh': 0.16; 'unusable.': 0.16; 'apps': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'app': 0.19; 'basically': 0.19; 'drawing': 0.19; 'slightly': 0.19; 'subject:] ': 0.20; 'machine': 0.22; 'example': 0.22; 'preferred': 0.22; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'days,': 0.24; 'fine': 0.24; "i've": 0.25; 'nearly': 0.26; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'chris': 0.29; 'am,': 0.29; 'bunch': 0.31; 'fine,': 0.31; 'run': 0.32; 'worked': 0.33; 'running': 0.33; 'ago': 0.33; 'connection': 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'version': 0.36; 'done': 0.36; "didn't": 0.36; 'subject:?': 0.36; 'virtual': 0.37; 'message- id:@gmail.com': 0.38; 'server': 0.38; 'feed': 0.38; 'mine': 0.38; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'fact': 0.38; 'anything': 0.39; "couldn't": 0.39; 'subject:can': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'either': 0.39; 'received:org': 0.40; 'days': 0.60; 'most': 0.60; 'helps': 0.61; 'traffic': 0.61; 'success': 0.61; 'high': 0.63; 'kind': 0.63; 'real': 0.63; 'such': 0.63; 'our': 0.64; 'more': 0.64; 'great': 0.65; 'effectively': 0.66; 'frequently': 0.68; 'applying': 0.72; 'low': 0.83; 'bandwidth.': 0.84; 'bitmap': 0.84; 'dramatically': 0.84; 'occupied': 0.84; 'inefficient': 0.91; 'killed': 0.91; 'pita.': 0.91; 'connection,': 0.95 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at torriefamily.org Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2014 07:10:52 -0600 From: Michael Torrie User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20131118 Thunderbird/17.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: python-list@python.org Subject: Re: [OT] What can Nuitka do? References: <4bfec709-263b-4c82-93ed-054432fd9d7e@googlegroups.com> <53ae31d6$0$29985$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <2f8d99b4-7a0b-47bf-8980-41f51cf7a9e7@googlegroups.com> <53AE411A.2080808@gmail.com> <2C380108368A4531B8E4C7287A344E6C@dev.null> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 33 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1404133869 news.xs4all.nl 2890 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:55056 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:73745 On 06/28/2014 09:16 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: >> I remember approx. 10 years ago a neighboring dept. at my work effectively >> killed our 10 MB/s Ethernet segment with such traffic (due to a >> misconfigured switch/router?). Running an ethernet analyzer showed a single >> X11 host-server session occupied ~80% bandwidth. AFAICR, it was a Sun >> workstation. >> A real PITA. > > Either that was a horribly inefficient X11 connection (as mine was - > the virtual machine sent basically a constantly-updated bitmapped > image to rdesktop, which then couldn't do anything more efficient than > feed that image to the X server), or something was horribly > misconfigured. I've frequently done much more reasonable X11 > forwarding, with high success and low traffic; Only the most primitive X11 apps are at all fast over network forwarding. If the app uses any modern toolkit, then it's basically just sending a bunch of bitmaps over the wire (changes), which would be fine, but X11 involves a lot of server round trips. Forwarding works fine over SSH on a LAN (compression with -X helps too), but anything slower than that is very nearly unusable. I used to run XEmacs over a modem (I know; I just preferred it to Emacs and I didn't know ViM), and it worked great with server-side drawing and fonts, as X11 was designed to do 90s-style. But now if I need to run X11 apps over a slower link these days I use OpenNX which dramatically helps by eliminating round trips, and applying bitmap compression. But the fact remains X11 kind of sucks these days, and "network transparency" now basically means a slightly suckier version of VNC in effect. RDP protocol is actually much more efficient than X11 forwarding with modern apps. So your rdesktop example is actually not a horribly inefficient X11 connection, other than the fact that X11 is inefficient. Honestly once Wayland has per-app RDP built into it, there'll be no reason at all to cheer for X11.