Path: csiph.com!x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net!aioe.org!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!feeder1.cambriumusenet.nl!feed.tweaknews.nl!postnews.google.com!news1.google.com!Xl.tags.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.speakeasy.net!news.speakeasy.net.POSTED!not-for-mail NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 08 May 2011 22:01:19 -0500 From: Robert Brown Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Subject: Re: Development time vs. runtime performance (was: Fibonacci series recursion error) References: <87iptw1egh.fsf@rudin.co.uk> <87ei4k0ygz.fsf@rudin.co.uk> <87aaf7246f.fsf@rudin.co.uk> <4dbd221a$0$29991$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <4dbedec0$0$29991$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <38f398-14h.ln1@svn.schaathun.net> <4dbf4a99$0$29991$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87hb9521ci.fsf@ugg.bibliotech.com> <4dc69395$0$29991$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87fwoprw1m.fsf@mithlond.arda> Date: Sun, 08 May 2011 23:01:18 -0400 Message-ID: <8739ko7f29.fsf@ugg.bibliotech.com> Organization: Bibliotech User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.2 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:qP0cD7oAE80ezjQv7x/NtpWR4NU= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Lines: 37 X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.81.198.234 X-Trace: sv3-XECNdLexX8DAWIZtZWgeVCodCWMRz0wts87OglfIog7Raw9Qq9Iw+kU4xRi3N0CQa3WGon+2cC9TTHN!wCUeU3aR/iDr/P0rkCrzSusMMOTOUjtIAMWxLgwo35DFBnSJnfqNbW7i85yD1KbzasSG6hryWo3Z!nyZMexAhUvqrVg== X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.40 X-Original-Bytes: 3617 Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.python:4969 Teemu Likonen writes: > * 2011-05-08T12:59:02Z * Steven D'Aprano wrote: > >> On Sun, 08 May 2011 01:44:13 -0400, Robert Brown wrote: >>> Python requires me to rewrite the slow bits of my program in C to get >>> good performance. >> >> Python doesn't require you to re-write anything in C. If you want to >> make a different trade-off (faster runtime, slower development time) >> then you use a language that has made the appropriate trade-off. > > I believe that Robert Brown wanted to imply that Common Lisp is quite > optimal on both sides. It supports dynamic interactive development and > yet it has implementations with very efficient compilers. The trade-off > is not necessarily between the two. Yes, exactly. Sometimes I don't know in advance which parts of my Python program will run too slowly or take too much memory. I only find out after the code is written, when it fails to run fast enough or doesn't fit in my computer's 32-bit address space. Then the slow parts get recoded in C. Common Lisp supports a larger performance range. A developer can write slow code quickly or faster code by giving the compiler more information, which requires more developer time. > But of course "development time" is a nicely vague concept. Depending on > the argument it can include just the features of language and > implementation. Other times it could include all the available resources > such as documentation, library archives and community mailing lists. All > these can reduce development time. This is definitely true. The total time to complete any task always depends on tons of factors outside of the programming language. The ecosystem is important ... How much code can I avoid writing myself? bob