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From: Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca>
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Newsgroups: comp.lang.java.programmer
Subject: Re: generics puzzle
References: <9g2f24Fi0vU1@mid.individual.net> <9g5nnhFahuU1@mid.individual.net> <9g5salFh1jU2@mid.individual.net> <j7lj89$su4$1@dont-email.me> <9g81mdFj6eU6@mid.individual.net>
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Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 06:22:26 -0300
Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.java.programmer:9067

On 11-10-19 10:29 AM, blmblm@myrealbox.com wrote:
> In article <j7lj89$su4$1@dont-email.me>, markspace  <-@.> wrote:
>> On 10/18/2011 10:45 AM, blmblm@myrealbox.com wrote:
[ SNIP ]

>> Try to learn a couple of IDEs, it'll help your Java career immensely.
> 
> s/career/something/ (I'm not a professional programmer these days.)
> 
> I find the interface of a typical IDE to be *WAY* too cluttered for
> my tastes.  But then that's true of a lot of programs with graphical
> interfaces.  Probably a YMMV thing.
> 
Not to start a war here (I use vi/vim a fair bit myself, GUI programming
text editors quite a lot, *and* also full-blown IDEs), but what do _you_
consider to be an IDE exactly?

I just now separated "full-blown" IDEs from other categories, but that's
just because people seem to think that vim/emacs are somehow
intrinsically different from Notepad++/TextMate are somehow
intrinsically different from Eclipse/NetBeans/MonoDevelop/Code::Blocks.

Again, not to start a war here, but an IDE is an Integrated Development
Environment. It doesn't have to involve any GUI programs at all, in
theory. For example, I occasionally write Clojure in vim, and execute
snippets by sending them to a REPL in another terminal window using
screen. That's an IDE.

Being GUI or somewhat GUI or not GUI at all is an orthogonal question.
IDE != GUI.

For that matter, given that GUI usually means WIMP (window, icon, menu,
pointer), and one may be disposed to be critical of GUIs, what exactly
is one critical of? Especially when sporting a customized emacs
installation with windows, menus, text-based pseudo-icons, and a
rapidly-moveable cursor? ;-)

Let me put it this way, if we are arguing for simplicity of interface,
I've seen a lot of emacs setups that weren't.

AHS