Path: csiph.com!x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder3.hal-mli.net!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder1.hal-mli.net!border3.nntp.dca.giganews.com!Xl.tags.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.earthlink.com!news.earthlink.com.POSTED!not-for-mail NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Jan 2012 20:17:19 -0600 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 2012 18:17:14 -0800 From: Patricia Shanahan User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:8.0) Gecko/20111105 Thunderbird/8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.java.programmer Subject: Re: Volatile happens before question References: <09848313-2372-4c23-8f52-fa84c612c100@u32g2000yqe.googlegroups.com> <1e7b4r38kmn2f$.1kwqeem7f8lxb.dlg@40tude.net> <4YydnRFXi_2GZojSnZ2dnUVZ_rKdnZ2d@earthlink.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: Lines: 17 X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 75.11.53.36 X-Trace: sv3-MDs0t7msCmvNf2LTuRPVodt1pflM0AFv/o3f83TqqrHGUjQSak+z/5mGFxbVxUVEfKwpkxsapf6vv+C!SKv+peScI8JD+4rEmMd4R1vc+JzL3sjVWdtyZeuOrfN0+gfdB1SRLO5qPQmT9UVM3pqTjqLeoUCO!eyI80uBPnHK3nWLm3I7IIH+zmZvb6ZuedEjNfkUfli8= X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.40 X-Original-Bytes: 2159 Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.java.programmer:11446 On 1/17/2012 5:14 PM, Peter Duniho wrote: > On Tue, 17 Jan 2012 14:49:58 -0800, Patricia Shanahan wrote: ... >> The potential incorrect intuition is that there is a total order of all >> events in a Java program. There isn't. [...] > > I think I understand what you're saying and I don't disagree, but the fact > remains that it is reasonable to consider the order of execution of > statements within the program relative to each other, as if it _were_ > possible to identify a total order. After all, any time there's a conflict > (e.g. two different threads writing atomically to the same memory location > at once), the CPU does pick a winner, even if non-deterministically. I agree that total ordering is a reasonable model of single processor operations, where there is such a thing as "the" CPU. Patricia