Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!cyclone03.ams2.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!voer-me.highwinds-media.com!npeersf03.am4!fx23.am4.POSTED!not-for-mail From: stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) Newsgroups: comp.lang.forth Subject: Re: RfD: Make ENVIRONMENT? obsolescent Reply-To: stephenXXX@INVALID.mpeforth.com Message-ID: <4ffeed7b.47486329@192.168.0.50> References: <2012Jul10.121933@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <2012Jul10.173803@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <2012Jul11.153258@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <2012Jul11.184450@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <2012Jul12.162312@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Lines: 39 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.176.152.87 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Trace: fx23.am4 1342108203 80.176.152.87 (Thu, 12 Jul 2012 15:50:03 UTC) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2012 15:50:03 UTC Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2012 15:45:29 GMT X-Received-Bytes: 2614 Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.forth:13899 On Thu, 12 Jul 2012 14:23:12 GMT, anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) wrote: >I did not sign such a contract, but I can agree with the notion that a >system that does not run a standard program without fiddling is not a >standard system. Now we have a problem. If you believe that, you cannot take the position that it is compliant to supply parts of the system as source code. The TC has used that position many times in the history of both ANS Forth and Forth200x. There is absolutely no way that any vendor is going to force a client to build a floating point pack into an embedded system. Compliance by source code is almost essential for embedded systems. >And yes, for a non-standard system some fiddling is to be expected >when I want to run a standard program, and that may include reading >the manual. But when a system is claimed to be standard, I expect >better of it. Your real complaint is that there is no standard way to ensure that a wordset is present. As yet, there is no common practice for this operation. Several suggestions have been made. Perhaps you would like to implement one of them on a range of systems as a pre-proposal activity? Mountains, molehills, mumble, mumble ... Stephen -- Stephen Pelc, stephenXXX@mpeforth.com MicroProcessor Engineering Ltd - More Real, Less Time 133 Hill Lane, Southampton SO15 5AF, England tel: +44 (0)23 8063 1441, fax: +44 (0)23 8033 9691 web: http://www.mpeforth.com - free VFX Forth downloads