Path: csiph.com!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!nntp.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Tim Rentsch Newsgroups: comp.arch Subject: Re: Random/OT: Low sample rate audio weirdness/mystery Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2026 00:40:24 -0700 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 49 Message-ID: <864imd60wn.fsf@linuxsc.com> References: <109h2c1$2vkis$1@dont-email.me> <20250906205251.00002067@yahoo.com> <86bjillw8o.fsf@linuxsc.com> <10ku4fc$3c80o$1@dont-email.me> <1769127215-5857@newsgrouper.org> <86bjhqhad1.fsf@linuxsc.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Injection-Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2026 07:40:27 +0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="d8ad6cc581418585937912c9311862c5"; logging-data="3810187"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19ix/9vXXN6wKZPYlWF4vdSKkHIhH9ztOU=" User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.4 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:qAh2rkDYHY7IgUr2titAkdn+8IU= sha1:aDb9Ok4LuUZWnRzeUWhlqQUBdiI= Xref: csiph.com comp.arch:115412 David Schultz writes: > On 2/14/26 10:57 PM, Tim Rentsch wrote: > >> David Schultz writes: >> >>> On 1/22/26 6:13 PM, MitchAlsup wrote: >>> >>>> The timber of instruments requires phase accurate reproduction of >>>> frequencies up to at least 15KHz. >>> >>> Define "phase accurate". As in how much phase error at say 20KHz is >>> acceptable to you. 1 degree? 10? >> >> Between 2 and 10 degrees, based on a rough calculation. >> >>> And how do you maintain that through the signal chain? In, for >>> example, speaker crossover networks. >> >> One way of doing that is to drive full-range electrostats >> directly from the output stage of the amplifier. > > A big panel launching a wave front at you. All with varying > distances/phase to your ear. One of the main points of using a panel speaker is they produce a plane wave rather than a collection of point sources. Undoubtedly there are some second-order effects because the panels have finite size but for the most part the phase is uniform over a fairly large area. > I love my Maggies but if I move my head even a few inches up or down > the high frequencies roll off enough for even my old lead ears to > notice. Magnepans and Magneplanars are okay. I didn't ever own Magnepans but I did own Magneplanars for a while and liked them. They weren't as good as the electrostats. I suspect the main reason for that is the much larger diaphragm mass of the Magneplanars, which causes its own kind of problems, including in particular frequency-dependent phase lag. I can say for sure that the electrostats were more transparent than the Magneplanars, even as good as they Magneplanars were. Regarding the high-frequency roll off - it's likey this does occur (high frequencies do beam after all) but in my experience it doesn't affect the listening experience much. Maybe that's because when I listen I tend to be stationary rather than moving. Also the ear is more sensitive to changes in phase than changes in amplitude.